Mr. Sorrels.

As far as I know----

Mr. Hubert.

You have no objections?

Mr. Sorrels.

No.

Mr. Hubert.

I take it those notes were made contemporaneously with the interviews, as they went on?

Mr. Sorrels.

The ones of Ruby were; yes.
Now, there is other stuff in here that had nothing to do with that.

Mr. Hubert.

Well, we are interested of course only in the Ruby ones. But you testified a little while ago, and you seemed to be referring to notes, about what Ruby said, and what happened and so forth in the first interview, and then also in the second interview.
The notes that you referred to on both occasions were made contemporaneously with the interview. That is, they were not made at a later date?

Mr. Sorrels.

That is correct.
Now, there is other stuff in this notebook. Like I went up to the identification bureau to check on his record and so forth, and got his detailed description, and his fingerprint classification--that had nothing to do with the interview.

Mr. Griffin.

I think we ought to take that to show what the practice was.

Mr. Hubert.

If you do not mind, we will have them photostated, and after we get the photostats, we will get them an identification number.
Suppose you tell us, then, what occurred at the second interview?

Mr. Sorrels.

Continuing with what I started out with a moment ago there, he incidentally, I have noted here on this page where I made these notations "3:15 p.m.," I assume that is possibly the time this interrogation took place. I do have the date, "11-24- 63."

Mr. Hubert.

The beginning of the notes relating to the interview in Captain Fritz' office?

Mr. Sorrels.

That is right.

Mr. Hubert.

It is your testimony now it would be your custom, as I understand it, to put the time at the beginning of the notes.

Mr. Sorrels.

Ordinarily we do. In this other one, I did not put the time.

Mr. Hubert.

All right.

Mr. Sorrels.

He gave his name as Jack Leon Ruby. He was asked about who his attorneys were, and he said that he was going to get Tom Howard and possibly Fred Brunner, and Stanley Kaufman, a civil attorney, and Jim Arnton.
In other words, he was going to consider those and C. A. Droby. He said that his name was changed in Dallas.

Now, I might put in here as an explanation that these are in response to questions that Captain Fritz was asking him. That he had this gun for 2 or 3 years. That George Senator was a roommate. That he came in the basement--the word "basement" is not shown here he came in off Main Street, off of the ramp. That he felt that Oswald was a Red, and that he was alone on this assassination. That he saw Oswald in the showup room, or a similar room. That he knew who he was going for. That he did not want to be a martyr. That he had built up--was a buildup of grievance. That he had closed both clubs.
And I have the notation here "Vegas, Oaklawn, 3508, Carousel, 1312 1/2 Commerce." That he never saw the man before this thing took place, referring to the time that he was down at the police station, or city hall, rather. That he had been in the mail- order business. That he had been a labor organizer. That he was fond of the police department.
And when Police Officer Slick had been killed--that is all I have in the notes, but he said that he grieved about that.
That he had been around Saturday night, that people were laughing, no one was in mourning. That he had seen a eulogy on TV. That he saw the President's brother, Bobby, on TV. That he guessed that there was created a moment of insanity. That he read about the letter that someone sent to little Caroline. That he knows the police department is wonderful. That his heart was with the police department. That he had hoped that if ever there was an opportunity--that he had hoped there was an opportunity for him to par ticipate in a police battle, and he could be a part of it, meaning on the side the police.